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  1. #1
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    Default Application Server, Web server

    I was going through the following link:

    App server, Web server: What's the difference? - JavaWorld

    It says, an application server provides access to business logic for use by client application programs.

    I understand that business logic is the code we write to acheive a particular functionality, but what does the whole statement mean?

    Can someone give me a concrete example of "providing access to business logic"?

    And when I write a java application in eclipse and say Run as -> Java Application, is it the application server or web server which is going to come into action?

  2. #2
    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    An application server provides the means to invoke said business logic from a client through several different paths.

    Its a very simplified description of an application server however; the proper definition of it used to be that it was a physical server machine that would be dedicated to be used to host an application; it didn't have anything to do with any server software specifically. Nowadays in the world of Java it refers to a software server that exposes the services as dictated by the Java Enterprise Edition specification.

    Run as -> Java Application
    Neither, I'd say. You run regular client side Java applications that way, you'd need some sort of 'run on server' to trigger Eclipse to start the server, optionally deploy the application and then open the default page in a browser. I just do all that myself, so I have more control over it.
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    An application server provides the means to invoke said business logic from a client through several different paths.

    Example pls.

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    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Why do you need examples? You too can use Google to get easy and quick answers. Example: I type in "java enterprise edition", which is something that you could have picked up on because I mentioned it in my previous reply. First hit of the search:

    Java Platform, Enterprise Edition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    This is not what I asked for. What is meant by "providing access to business logic for use by client application program."? I am sorry I am not from computer science background.

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    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    How can I give you an answer you can understand if you don't have the proper background?

    I'll translate it in a different form, perhaps that helps. "Client applications can run stuff on the server through different ways".
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Suppose my client application is Mozilla firefox browser and I type some url in the address bar, is there an application server invloved?

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    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    If it is an url that points to a Java web resource such as a servlet, JSP, JSF page or whatever other web framework is used then yes, an application server (or servlet container) is involved.

    But it doesn't limit to a browser, it could be any kind of client application. Because as the link I provided you will tell you, there are multiple ways to communicate with the server side software. A web url is one way, but there is also remote Enterprise Javabeans, SOAP webservices, RESTful webservices, Messaging, etc. So it could be any kind of application, built using any kind of technology.


    BTW: you are not confusing Java with Javascript, are you? I ask because you throw a browser into the mix all of a sudden...
    Last edited by gimbal2; 08-05-2013 at 02:28 PM.
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    No, I am not confusing java with javascript. Ok, lets start from the scratch.

    If I type www.google.com on the browser is there an application server involved?

    Sorry for the ignorance and stupid questions
    Last edited by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com; 08-06-2013 at 05:21 AM.

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    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    How would I know? I don't work for google.
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

  11. #11
    Tolls is offline Moderator
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    The servers that you hit when accessing google.com are web servers, since they serve web pages.
    Web servers are a subset of application servers which cover the more generic client/server architecture.

    Web servers are generally (I think possibly solely?) accessed via http (hence "web").
    As with everything there are undoubtedly people who use these terms in different ways, but I like to keep things simple.
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  12. #12
    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    (or https). I agree with you in general, but it is indeed terminology used in such widely varying and misguided ways that I actually try to avoid referring to it. You see, modern day application servers can ALSO service web resources since they have a web server integrated into them and so are also accessed through http/https - as one of the possible means to communicate with an AS, but certainly not the only one. To a web server you would ONLY connect through http/https, indeed.
    Last edited by gimbal2; 08-06-2013 at 10:25 AM.
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    Tolls is offline Moderator
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by gimbal2 View Post
    (or https).
    Subset of http...:)
    Quote Originally Posted by gimbal2 View Post
    I agree with you in general, but it is indeed terminology used in such widely varying and misguided ways that I actually try to avoid referring to it. You see, modern day application servers can ALSO service web resources since they have a web server integrated into them and so are also accessed through http/https - as one of the possible means to communicate with an AS, but certainly not the only one. To a web server you would ONLY connect through http/https, indeed.
    In which case it is an application server.
    A web server is a specific kind of application server.

    And this is all assuming we're talking software here.
    All server hardware are application servers, unless someone can dig one out that can only use http(s).
    Please do not ask for code as refusal often offends.

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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    I understand that application server is more comprehensive than web server since it serves number of protocols including http.

    But what on earth is meant by saying application server provide access to business logic for use by client application programs?

    How can a client application program have access to business logic? I am really confused.

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    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com View Post
    But what on earth is meant by saying application server provide access to business logic for use by client application programs?
    My entire reply 8 covers that. If you don't understand... yeah sorry but then you simply are not in the position to understand all this. Without knowing any math you can go to a convention for mathematicians, but you're only going to come out even more confused.
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

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    Tolls is offline Moderator
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com View Post
    How can a client application program have access to business logic? I am really confused.
    What do you think happens when you click "Google search" or "I'm feeling lucky"?
    You are accessing Google's business logic (the search functionality) that resides on their application servers.
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by Tolls View Post
    What do you think happens when you click "Google search" or "I'm feeling lucky"?
    You are accessing Google's business logic (the search functionality) that resides on their application servers.
    Ok understood.

    When I hit http://www.google.com in the browser the web server comes into action.

    So how can you say web server does not provide access to business logic through client application programs?
    Last edited by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com; 08-06-2013 at 01:17 PM.

  18. #18
    gimbal2 is offline Just a guy
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com View Post
    Exactly what I wanted. Some people may not be from computer science background, like me. They may be required to be taught with an example, like this.
    Well, good luck with that!
    "Syntactic sugar causes cancer of the semicolon." -- Alan Perlis

  19. #19
    Tolls is offline Moderator
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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    Quote Originally Posted by suhaas.mohandos@gmail.com View Post
    Ok understood.

    When I hit Google in the browser the web server comes into action.

    So how can you say web server does not provide access to business logic through client application programs?
    Maybe I should have read that article, but it's not correct.
    First it's 10+ years old.
    Second I don't think it was even correct back then, as REST had already been defined a couple of years earlier.

    A web server no longer just serves web pages, but it still sits behind http.
    Ajax also changed this, as you could request data from the server via http and then process the (eg) JSON response in Javascript, changing the visible page in that way.

    So a web server can provide access to business logic.
    Please do not ask for code as refusal often offends.

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    Default Re: Application Server, Web server

    So let's summarise:

    Web server:
    1. Handles http requests
    2. Can provide access to business logic.

    Application Server:
    1. Handles all requests including http
    2. Provides access to business logic.

    Pls help me add more points.

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